County council member Valerie Ervin (D-5) warned South Silver Spring residents Monday night that opposition to the Purple Line project was mounting.
“This is a nervous time in our community. People are afraid of change of any kind,” Ervin told about 30 members of the South Silver Spring Neighborhood Association. “I am very worried about this.”
Her concerns for the Purple Line stemmed from a meeting last week between the state transit administration and East Silver Spring residents. According to Ervin, most people at that meeting opposed construction of the light-rail line, which would connect Bethesda with New Carrollton through Silver Spring.
“The problem is that people think the Purple Line is the Metro,” Ervin said. However, the light-rail project “will be quieter than the Metro,” she contended.
Ervin indicated that the state transit administration was leaning away from a subterranean route beneath Silver Spring and Thayer avenues in East Silver Spring. According to Ervin, the transit administration determined the cost of tunnel construction to be prohibitive.
The transit administration is considering another route through East Silver Spring, which would run the Purple Line at street level along Wayne Avenue. However, none of the routes through Silver Spring have been finalized.
Read 
What the hell are they building now? Learn more from 
Boxed wines and rosés are back in vogue. Just ask The Penguin's sommeliers.
I hope the NIMBYs don’t derail this much-needed transportation improvement.
The people in my neighborhood support the Purple Line, but we do not support having the damn thing run above-ground down Wayne Avenue. Doing it that way is pennywise and pound foolish, not to mention terrible for the people who live along Wayne.
Either do the purple line right, which is below ground, or don’t do it at all.
We can’t let the perfect be the enemy of the good. And all or nothing stance is nothing more than NIMBYism in disguise.
The purple line will never run below ground because of the costs involved. The purple line is greatly needed in an ever increasing urban environment. That is what the downtown Silver Spring area is becoming. I am concerned that the NIMBY and CAVE folks will torpedo this project. They have never presented any good arguments against the purple line. Besides not wanting the purple line, these are the same people that don’t want any new development. Oh, they will tell you that they are for the purple line or for new development but they put up so many roadblocks and restrictions as ways to get what they wanted all along- to effectively kill these projects.
I’m guessing the pro-above ground Purple Line supporters here don’t live along Wayne Avenue.
Leaving aside the fact that a training running down the street will wreak havoc on the people who live on that street. Wayne Avenue is already congested, and the purple line will remove two lanes of traffic, thereby making it worse, not better.
You also don’t run a train through a suburban neighborhood filled with houses and kids and pets. That’s how you destroy neighborhoods.
If Rome can put tunnels underneath its city streets, Silver Spring can do the same. If it costs more money, raise everyone’s taxes by a few dollars for a few years, with the funds earmarked only for the purple line project.
“thereby making it worse, not better.”
Stop complaining about traffic woes without offering tangible solutions.
Tangible solution: underground subway train — like I already said.
“You also don’t run a train through a suburban neighborhood filled with houses and kids and pets. That’s how you destroy neighborhoods.”
Please visit St. Charles Ave. in New Orleans before you make this ridiculously uninformed argument again. (Actually, wait a year or so before they rebuild it, or ask anyone else who has been there how much the St. Charles Ave. Streetcar has “destroyed” the Garden District).
An electric trolley is less noisy than a city bus, and has been shown to increase property values along its path.
You don’t have to go to New Orleans and wait a year to see how a transit rail line adds value to even an upscale neighborhood. My daughter lives in a neighborhood with a transit rail running through it, and the transit it goes on to run on the streets of downtown Media, PA. Media recognized its trolley recently by putting the trolley on its 150 year celebration teashirt. Most of us in my Woodside neighborhood can not afford to touch a house in these Media neighborhoods. So – the argument that you can’t run a transit rail through a neighborhood without devastating it is very uninformed.
The purple line will not wreak havoc or destroy neighborhoods. Again, I have not heard any concrete evidence from any of the NIMBYs to support this. There may be some added congestion for those who drive up Wayne. For those folks I say get out of your damn car and take the purple line instead. I ride the Metro everyday and it is great knowing that I am doing my part to reduce global warming. I wonder if part of the fear in having the purple line is the fact that it will link up with Long Branch, a lower socio-economic neighborhood?
The St. Charles trolley isn’t a good comparison. I’d imagine the volume of the Purple line would be much higher. But, maybe that would be a better solution. Build more, smaller trolleys that filter into local Metro stations, rather than a line that criss-crosses the region. Or, maybe it would allow the Purple line to be relocated.
Calling people “NIMBYS” is as intellectually lazy as calling people “politically correct” when they voice an opinion you don’t like. It’s a substitute for thinking.
I don’t live along Wayne Avenue, but the people I know who do live there do indeed fear for their children and pets and quality of life. The old folk at the Springvale retirement home at Springvale and Wayne fear what the noise and traffic of the above-ground train will do to their lives. Tell them that they are ridiculously uninformed; I’ll bring the popcorn.
It’s one thing to run a trolley through a town’s main streets, and another to run it down a residential suburban neighborhood while taking out two important lanes of a road.
Why not build it underground? Oh that’s right — it costs more. Instead, some of you are willing to sacrifice other people’s quality of lives for a transit option that you say will benefit the greater good. I’m all for the greater good, so why not look out for some of our fellow citizens and do this in a way that won’t sacrifice them on the alter of efficiency: put the train underground, and raise taxes to pay for the added costs.
The purple line was always meant to connect the Silver Spring and Bethesda metro stations; it still should — underground.
Unfortunately, “put the train underground, and raise taxes to pay for the added cost” is not a real option.
Speak to anyone who is familiar with the selection process to receive federal matching funds for transit projects, and you learn that a project must compete based on overall cost and cost effectiveness. Local jurisdictions do not have the option to kick in “the difference” from local taxes if the overall cost of the project is too high. Competition for federal support is very fierce, and the cost of more than very selective undergrounding will knock a project out of competition. I would support changing the rules to allow local taxes to be used to “upgrade” the project so we can do as “Springvale reader” suggests, but we have to live with the rules we have now. Undergrounding the Purple Line is not a real option.
“The purple line was always meant to connect the Silver Spring and Bethesda metro stations; it still should — underground.”
What should happen to the purple line and what reality is are two different things. There is no way that an underground purple line will occur. The MTA has already stated that it is “cost prohibitive”. We need to stop beating this dead horse. An underground purple line will not happen. We are now left with 2 options, a light-rail system along Wayne Ave. or no purple line at all.
The pros for the purple line- decrease in the amount of cars on the road (lower air pollution as a result), shorter commuter times, a link for the lower socio-economic neighborhood of Long Branch to the Metro system.
The cons for the purple line- so far the main argument has been increase noise. The light rail system is nothing like the trains on the Metro. The increase in noise is not a good argument to make. What else is there? Oh, yeah- it will take the locals on Wayne Ave. an extra 45 seconds to make there way home at night. Big, freaking deal.
I would like to know exactly how we are “sacrificing other people’s lives “. Again, these are buzz words used by the NIMBYs to act as scare tactics in opposition to the purple line. The NIMBYs need to get over their melodramatic use of words. There is no substance to their arguments.
Light rail is a notorious boondoggle. Federal research indicates that quality bus systems are one-fifth the cost per passenger mile of light rail per passenger mile, can accommodate the volumes and operate nearly as fast. Nearly everywhere is has been built in the last several decades it is an extremely expensive failure. It may run slightly faster than buses – having its own track – but it still has to stop at lights, etc… and does not integrate directly with the metro, as an underground line would. It is only marginally better than buses at enormous expense and impact on the neighborhood. Underground or not at all!
Thanks for your comments. Please play nice. :-)
I do not buy the argument that obtaining federal funds will be impossible if the train is put underground. I do not buy the argument that it is cost-prohibitive to put the train underground. It is both politically and financially possible to have the purple line go underground. Those who say it cannot be done are wrong.
Hi, everyone! Let me interject for a second.
Obtaining federal funds for the Purple Line requires the state of Maryland to present an economically viable project. That is, the cost-to-benefit numbers must look favorably upon mass transit.
Also, the Purple Line project must compete with other similar projects from throughout the country for these federal funds. The Purple Line is even competing against other Maryland projects, including the Red Line in Baltimore.
Is obtaining federal funds for an underground Purple Line impossible? I can’t say that anything is impossible. However, the odds really stack up against Purple Line development if the state can’t keep costs down.
The perfect example is unfolding in Virginia, with the Dulles extension of the Orange Line. The commonwealth would like to run the train beneath Tysons Corner, but the costs could decrease their chances of scoring that much needed federal dough.
So they went with an elevated track.The tunnel issue is still up for debate in Virginia.My thought is this: If money grew on trees, then an underground Purple Line would be a sure thing. A subterranean track is my preference.
But money doesn’t grow on trees, and even if it did, global warming would kill those trees eventually. Therefore, a street-level (or elevated) Purple Line is what we’re left with.
And I can live with that.
MONORAIL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Editor’s note: Dude, have we learned nothing from “The Simpsons”? — JD (Oct 24, 2007)
KDS wrote:
Thanks for your comments, KDS!
They are a reminder that the Purple Line, if built, is not guaranteed to be light rail. The state has not nixed bus rapid transit as an option, though light rail seems to be the heir apparent.
I will try to mention the bus rapid transit option in future Purple Line posts.
Springvale – Agreed!
Think 50 or 100 years down the road. An underground tunnel linking the inner MD suburbs would be seen as an invaluable asset. Looking back, the cost-benefit will be seen as a no-brainer (as Metro’s original construction seems today).
Light rail, on the other hand is the worst of both worlds. A heavy capital expense that is only a marginal improvement on buses.
Props to the MONORAIL! guest. It’s nice to know that someone is looking out for all those drunken slobs, but is there a chance the track will bend?
Okay Jennifer, just one last word on this topic. Competing for federal funds depends on the nature of the project. If Maryland put forth a plan only for an underground train, then it and its potential contractors would submit various bids and the lowest-cost bid which met the specifications of the project would succeed.
As for money, rather than pour cash into the environmental and dysfunctional black hole that is the proposed ICC, that money can go instead to an underground purple line.
I support any kind of Purple Line rail: underground or street-level. I don’t care how this gets done. The vehicle traffic in Silver Spring is absolutely horrible. I avoid Colesville and Georgia Ave. during rush hour. And even after rush hour, it’s still a nightmare getting anywhere.
I have a proposal for WMATA. Build a Silver Line from Silver Spring to Columbia, MD. Dear God, most of the traffic clogging up Silver Spring are commuters between Howard County and Washington, DC. Route 29 is congested from downtown past Cherry Hill Road during the rush hours. Although the Purple Line addresses the Bethesda to PG County traffic congestion problem; the North-South traffic flow needs to be addressed as well.
The automobile is one BIG contributing factor to global warming and unhealthy air pollution. We need to build more transportation systems that gets people out of their damn cars and into more environmentally friendly modes of transit. I also think employers should allow workers to clock in a day’s work from home.
Amen, yuppie hater. That is the best statement I’ve ever read of yours on any blog.
Fact is that the purple line will do very little, if nothing about traffic. What you’ll get is people from places like Langley Park taking it instead of the bus and possibly a few from PG getting out of their cars. Any minor gain in new riders will be vastly offset by all the new construction coming to SS in the next decade. Plus, advocates for these kinds of projects (look up recent light rail projects in dozens of american cities) always overestimate ridership and impact on traffic.
“Fact is that the purple line will do very little, if nothing about traffic. ”
This is erroneous information. If we look at what is happening in Silver Spring right now, there are new condos and new rental apartment buildings being built (Gateway, Argent, Portico, etc.) and several more planned (Falkland North, 1050 Ripley, etc.). As these units come on-line, traffic in the DTSS will only get worse. The people occupying these buildings will be the new, Silver Spring urbanites who will have more of a tendency to embrace the use of mass transit whenever possible. The traffic situation in DTSS is already crazy and will only get worse. How else do you propose to alleviate the traffic congestion that already exists? The fact is that the purple line will absolutely help to alleviate the traffic congestion.
Also, let’s look at the route of the purple line. One of the appeals of the purple line for me is that it will be a quick trip for me to get to Bethesda and Rockville. Occassionally I will hit those two areas to either eat at a restaurant or to do some shopping. I almost always drive there. There is no incentive for me to take that long metro ride into the District with the loop back into Maryland. However, if the purple line was built, I would take that ride into Bethesda or Rockville all of the time (especially if I can avoid driving on Rockville Pike). I know that there are many people that feel the same way. Also, I would take the purple line to get to two of my favorite restaurants in Langely Park, Tiffins and Udupi Palace, instead of driving there as I do now. I am sure that once the Fillmore is built, we will have folks from Bethesda and Rockville taking the purple line into Silver Spring. With stops in Bethesda, Langley Park, Silver Spring and College Park I have no doubt that the purple line will get heavy usage.
WCDB, I agree that the purple line will reduce the number of cars now used by people who want to get from SS to Bethesda and beyond on the Shady Grove side of the red line. The problem is that even if this wonderful connection is made, there is still the issue of crime at the SS metro stop late at night.
We often go to Bethesda for dinner and a movie on weekend nights (note — the Bethesda metro stop is not all that convenient to the restaurant row area, but that’s another story). However, we would not want to return past midnight and walk home from the SS metro. It’s simply too dangerous right now. Until the crime issue is addressed, I think you’ll still see plenty of car traffic going to and from Bethesda.
I disagree with Springvale about the crime issue. In fact, we have more safety in downtown Silver Spring than ever before. I have walked ALONE late in the evening from downtown Silver Spring to my residence at Summit Hills many, many times since I moved here in 2001. Not once I have experienced an unsafe situation nor have I noticed any unscrupulous activity along the way. Furthermore, I have seen more Montgomery County police presence on city streets.
I feel very safe in Silver Spring at night.
IHY, the crime reports in the Gazette contradict your claims, and that’s only what makes the reports.
I have walked home alone late at night after getting off the Silver Spring metro stop. While it it relatively safe to walk around that area, I do “watch my back” because I do read the police blotters on a consistent basis and there is the occassional mugging that occurs around that metro stop. However, it doesn’t happen too often and it is not enough to deter me from using the metro late at night but the area could definitely use more of a police presence.
Granted, it’s not downtown Baghdad, but two years ago I was assaulted by about a dozen teenagers on a Tuesday night at 7 pm one block from Whole Foods, and even though I reported the incident to the police, it never made the crime report in the Gazette or the Post (I and the kids had a Mexican standoff; the only reason things didn’t escalate is because I know better than to take on a dozen teenage boys).
I have had extensive reality-based self defense training, and I alway carry at least one legal weapon, but I’m still liable to have a lousy night if I run into one skinny teenaged boy armed with a knife or a gun. That’s why I never walk home late at night from the SS metro whenever possible — and when I do, I’m on high alert.
Are you really opposing the Purple Line because you fear crime issues late at night? If that’s the case, don’t plan on using the Purple Line at night, but don’t stop everyone else from taking it to work and for pleasure.
First, I have never written that I opposed the purple line; I, like others, desire the purple line but want it put underground. Second, I did not cite crime as a reason to oppose the purple line. I cited crime as a reason why the purple line may not reduce the flow of traffic between Silver Spring and Bethesda as much as some people are hoping.
Editor’s note: This comment has been edited for content. — JD (Oct 25, 2007)
Why don’t we just bring more damn jobs to Silver Spring, and more damn entertainment to Silver Spring, so people who live in Silver Spring will walk to things in Silver Spring to do instead of driving to surronding areas all the damn time.
And if you want to get to Bethesda, just take the J2 bus, which essentially the same exact hours as the metro, is safe, and stops at both metro stations.
Springvale Roader: Read the crime report. Downtown Silver Spring to Summit Hills is not near Piney Branch which is where 99.9% of the crime is reported.
rd, I agree with you about the location of the majority of crimes reported for the SS area. Still, it is not unusual to see “strongarm” robberies in DTSS, including the vicinity of the metro. That, coupled with my own experience, mitigates against walking home past midnight from the metro, particularly on weeknights.
P.S. Okay Jennifer, I’ll play nicer. :)
Back on topic — I think Val Ervin and gang don’t have anything to worry about as far a citizen opposition if they look at the total level of support in the community for this project. I’d welcome a scientific poll done zip code by zip code in the beltway area and inner-beltway communities of MoCo and PG. Just because those who oppose it are more apt to attend these events to scream at MTA employees, does not mean they are the majority.
IHY – that was indeed your best post ever. A N-S commuter line on Rt 29 just makes too much sense doesn’t it? For some unknown reason this is a hot potato that no one will touch.
Yuppie hater, you’ll be happy to know that all the overpasses on US 29 in Montgomery County are being built with room to put light rail underneath in the median (there’s room for light or heavy, actually light rail needs more overhead clearance for the wires). This was done at the suggestion of the Action Committee for Transit almost ten years ago.
The really hard part of rail on US 29 is how to connect from White Oak to the the rest of the Metro system. When this was last looked at in the 1990s, the only reasonable route was to go down Colesville Road to the Silver Spring Metro. This requires either losing two lanes of traffic – fiercely resisted by State Highway and undoubtedly by many drivers – or running the trains mixed in traffic – losing much of the speed advantage – or going underground – prohibitively expensive. Once the Purple Line is built, there will be additional options, connecting to the Purple Line via New Hampshire Ave or University Boulevard. Whether either of these could be made to work would require a lot of engineering study.
ACT advocates light rail on US 29 as part of its long-range goal – see this map which is on our website and in our printed brochure:
http://www.innerpurpleline.org/images/ACTflyerinside-Color.gif
WeCanDoBetter,
You are looking for good arguments against the light rail. Well here goes.
It is not scalable and will not be able to go west from Bethesda or Medical Center as would a buried MetroRail Line. It will be too slow to be a well-thought out and executed solution to regional traffic problems. The Purple Line light rail plan is a tiny band-aid on the gaping wound that is metropolitan Washington DC traffic. It will not do the job that is necessary. Save the money and do it right when the money is available. Heavy, fast, underground rail that eventually reach Tyson’s Corner.
Well, my street finally woke up and is plastered with signs saying “No train for Wayne”. Those of you calling people like me a NIMBY do not live on Wayne, I’m sure of that. We have buses galore, every police car and ambulance in town, sirens wailing, and wall to wall cars. And you want to add the Purple Line to that AND you want to live here? Give me a break. Sligo Ave., which was never really in the running, organized immediately but now we are waking up.
Do not wreck our neighborhood with a poorly thought out “band aid”. We already put up with alot and this will only make the quality of life here worse, while NOT solving the problem.
Editor’s note: This person’s screen name has been modified. — JD (Jun 10, 2008)
running a train down a now very busy street will not add too much to the noise and danger factors of the area. having cars running 30+ down wayne is just as dangerous, maybe more. a train may even reduce some of those problems– maybe reduce congestion in the best case scenario.
also, if you really want an isolated and completely suburban place to live, go move to a private, gated community where the grass can’t grow more than two inches, there are restrictions on the colors of your house, and there is no real life.
WCDB mentions Falkland North. One-third of the beautiful Falkland Chase Apartments would be demolished to construct a high-rise for that project. That is only the beginning. If the Purple Line were built, all the small-scale housing along its route would be endangered. The apartments in Long Branch and Langley Park would be replaced with “luxury” (read: expensive) high-rises. The small, beautiful houses with small yards and big trees in East Silver Spring would be demolished and replaced with McMansions.
Redevelopment is the purpose of the Purple Line, not transportation improvement. Silver Spring has endured enough bulldozing. Both MoCo an Prince George’s have small, crummy commercial buildings and/or undistinguished strip malls scattered about. Many of those sites could be redeveloped with several stories of housing above, and served by buses — Metrobus Ride-On and The Bus. The businesses could be in the first floor of the new buildings, so there would be no displacement.
“NIMBY” is used by several commenters above. It is an acronym for “Not In My Back Yard.” One Purple Line plan would have literally taken backyards in East Silver Spring — hundreds of trees and several homes. That route was then proposed for deep tunnel, and Ervin is quoted above as saying that looks doubtful.
The main advantage of rail is the ability to take it underground. On the surface, it could take a couple of lanes of a big, ugly street, especially if it had few hills & curves, without doing physical damage. I can think of one such street in particular. It is in the Midwest.
The Purple Line in our beautiful, green community is a wildly destructive idea that should never have made it out of a brainstorming session. NIMBY is often used as a slur against people who obsess about property values. People who are truly afraid of having their homes or yards sezied by eminent domain do not deserve to be called NIMBYs.
LuvMyHood- Instead of criticizing everything, please give examples of how the DC region can help get cars off our already congested roads and improve public transportation to help combat global warming.
Editor’s note: This comment was edited for content. — JD (Jul 1, 2008)
Green, since you asked…Transportation System Management, aka TSM, is the answer. It does not involve any one big, expensive thing, so developers don’t give $ to politicians to push for it. Here are some aspects:
More regular route buses, like Metrobus, Rid-On, The Bus,
More express buses, like the J4
More commuter buses like those MTA already operates
A system that works to tell when buses are coming (NextBus was dropped, at least temporarily)
More bus shelters
Improved taxi system, including neighborhood taxis — especially good for those who are too old or young to drive
More car sharing, such as ZipCar — cuts down on the need for household car ownership
More telecommuting options
An end to the notion that long hours at work mean more productivity — how many people drive to work because they fear getting stuck there when working late?
Banning Right-Turn on Red in many places
Adding more crosswalks, and making them more visible
Putting more buses, cars and taxis on the roads is not the answer. All that is going to do is create more pollution, increase the cost of gasoline and increase the time in traffic. We need to DECREASE the number of vehicles on the road, not increase it. We need the purple line and we need it now!
LuvMyHood – you just suggested putting MORE GAS POWERED VEHICLES on the road to solve our region’s traffic problem and global warming!!!!!! LMAO
“More regular route buses, like Metrobus, Rid-On, The Bus,
More express buses, like the J4
More commuter buses like those MTA already operates
A system that works to tell when buses are coming (NextBus was dropped, at least temporarily)
More bus shelters
Improved taxi system, including neighborhood taxis — especially good for those who are too old or young to drive
Green, I failed to mention that many, if not most, of the new Metrobuses are the diesel-electric hybrids. Ride-On and The Bus are using similar models.
No one said taxis cannot be hybrids. Some Zipcar models are hybrids, too.
If NextBus or something similar can work, it can also provide valuable feedback for managing routes efficiently.
Remember, the Purple Line would run on electricity from our already-strained grid. And if the coal comes from Va. or Ky, it may well be strip-mined, or even obtained via mountaintop removal.
I agree with LuvMyHood, we shouldn’t be getting the energy to power the purple line from our coal-driven energy grid. We need to tap other sources of energy to power the purple line. We can power the purple line by placing a few mini-nuclear reactors in East Silver Spring. Better yet, we could place some windmills up and down Wayne Ave. We could also put up a hydro-electric dam at Sligo Creek. How about placing a giant solar panel where the turf is?
Editor’s note: Play nice, people. — JD (Jul 2, 2008)
Luvmyhood, you may know that the MTA’s Draft Environmental Impact Statement/Alternatives Analysis is required to compare the environmental impacts of TSM options with the impacts of the various purple line mode and alignment options. The analysis will also compare the travel times and ridership that would be derived from TSM enhancements such as those you describe with projected travel times and ridership associated with different purple line alternatives.
It would be nice if people on both sides of the issue would be willing to reconsider their positions based on the empirical information in the AA/DEIS, but I don’t think the study will move anyone from the camp they are in. If the AA/DEIS comes out in favor of one of the purple line options (which I predict it will) the supporters will use the information to bolster their cause and odds are the opponents will write off the data, claiming that MTA rigged the numbers to support a pre-determined outcome. If the reverse happens, than supporters will likely seek to come up with alternate data that supports their point of view.
I’m in favor of the purple line in theory but am witholding judgement about which, if any, alternative, is worth pursuing until I have a chance to read the AA/DEIS.
I just wish that some of the opponents, like luvmyhood, would likewise keep an open mind, rather than rushing to predict doom and gloom in no uncertain terms.